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020: Michele Molitor – The Mind Detective: Taming Your Self-Doubt & Discovering That You Are Enough

Michele Molitor is a hypnotherapist, coach, speaker, author, and Founder and CEO of Nectar Consulting. Michele has been using her intuitive insights and strategic savvy to support entrepreneurs for nearly thirty years.

Today, Jonathan and Michele dive deep into Imposter Syndrome and other archetypes of self-doubt. Michele speaks to the work she has done with Rapid Transformational Therapy (RTT), the power of positive affirmations, and why it is critical to respond rather than react to self-doubt.

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Key Takeaways

00:59 – Jonathan introduces today’s guest, Michele Molitor, who shares where she got her entrepreneurial spirit and how working with other entrepreneurs has evolved over the years

10:27 – The incredible burst of businesses in the wake of the global pandemic

13:04 – Imposter Syndrome, the debilitating impact it can have, and what causes it

23:44 – Social media and self-comparison

27:52 – The Five Archetypes of Self-Doubt

34:56 – Tips and best practices for combating self-doubt

41:32 – Jonathan shares a personal story of how hypnotherapy helped him as a child

43:59 – Pandemic PTSD

47:33 – One practice to implement to combat self-doubt and one to avoid

54:24 – The last thing Michele changed her mind about and one thing that she would like people to know about her

57:07 – Jonathan thanks Michele for joining the show and let’s listeners know where to connect with her

Tweetable Quotes

“The thought of joining the family business and being under the judgmental eye of my mom, my dad, my brother and my sister, I said, ‘Oh no. That is so not happening.’ So, I actually ran as faraway as I could possibly conceive, which was back to France for me. So, becoming an entrepreneur myself wasn’t something I expected to do. It’s something I kind a stumbled into.”(06:26)

“Job security isn’t so secure anymore. People don’t stay in jobs for ten, twenty, thirty years anymore. It’s just unheard of. And there’s not that level of loyalty I think in corporations nearly as much either.”(11:05)

“One of my favorite quotes is, ‘When you look fear in the face, it turns into the nothingness that it actually is.’”(16:45)

“It’s a level of knowledge and expertise that you bring to the table. When you’re nineteen, you’re still green and still learning. So, I’m learning and I’m putting my big girl pants on and I’m trying to look professional, but I’m still not quite sure who I am yet. I think Imposter Syndrome qualifies more as Imposter Syndrome when you’ve grown a bit more, you’re more mature, you know who you are to degrees, and you’ve had some level of established profession.”(18:00)

“No matter how hard someone tries to separate their business from their personal life, they are the human at the center of all of it. And it’s the beliefs they hold about themselves that have them show up fully or hide out – whether that’s personally or professionally.”(26:53)

“We all deal with self-doubt at some point in our lives; no one escapes it. The trick is learning to recognize it in the moment more quickly, because you’re more self-aware, and then learning how to respond effectively versus react from a place of pain or fear. That’s the crux right there is how do I respond versus react. And that’s where the learning happens.”(34:20)

“If we can take more time to pause in our day, to get quiet, to tune in to our own heart – our owns pirit in that place of mindfulness – to go to that void, that we can get more connected to our own higher self, our own divinity if you will, and let that inform us as to what’s needed now.”(53:10)

Guest Resources

Nectar Consulting Website

Facebook Michele Molitor Coach Page

Rewire For Success group on FB

Michele’s Website

Michele’s LinkedIn

Michele’s Instagram

Michele’s YouTube

Michele’s Book

Self-Doubt Finder Quiz

Online Course: How To Become Unshakeable

Mindful Money Resources

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Episode Transcription

Jonathan DeYoe: Hello. Welcome back. On this episode of the Mindful Money podcast, I’m chatting with M. Michele Molitor Michele is a coach, hypnotherapist, speaker, and author. She’s the founder and CEO of Nectar Consulting, Inc. And co author of the bestseller Breakthrough Healing. She’s been using intuitive insights and strategic savvy to support entrepreneurs for over 30 years. Over 30 years? Really? No, just about 30 years. I think it’s approaching 30 years. Am I right?

Michele Molitor: Yeah, somewhere in there.

Jonathan DeYoe: Okay. I’ve known Michele for years. I don’t know, we’re mostly getting close to 15 or more years at this point.

Michele Molitor: It’s closer to 20, my friend.

Jonathan DeYoe: 20. Oh, my goodness. Yeah. Okay. And I, uh, wanted to have this conversation with her on this podcast because starting your own thing is hard, objectively, but so often we also just get in our own way. It’s about mindset, and when we get in our own way, we need to reset the mindset. And her clients have dubbed her the mind detective because she’s an expert on helping them with the mental game, which is just perfect for the earned season of the Mindful Money podcast. Michele welcome to the podcast.

Michele Molitor: Thank you, my friend.

Speaker B: Jonathan.

Michele Molitor: Ah, it’s so great to be here with you. So excited.

Jonathan DeYoe: I’m excited to have you here. So just kicking off, where do you call home?

Michele Molitor: I live in Hayward, California, just south of Berkeley, by 20, 30 minutes, depending on fast you drive. And I’ve been out here in the Bay area for, this is my 22nd year, so this is definitely home. But I grew up on the east coast in Florida, and, uh, spent a boatload of time in Atlanta as well. So I’m a southern girl at heart, but definitely grounded here.

Jonathan DeYoe: So I don’t know if everyone that interviews you knows you as well as I do, but I want to hear a little bit about personal, a little bit about your roommates. I know you have some both in the house and visitors from outside. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Speaker B: Yes.

Michele Molitor: My house is lovingly called the critter cottage for good reason. Have a gaggle of cats and a gothan cockatoo named Alice who is large and in charge and literally climbs down off her cage and chases the cats out of the house. And then I have an assortment of other visitors because my house backs up to canyon. I get, you know, visitors from deer and turkey and skunks and possums and raccoons. On occasion, they like to come in the house, but buttercup, my littlest kitten, she literally sleeps at the back door and will scare any foreign intruders out. Hilarious.

Jonathan DeYoe: It’s good to have a defender.

Michele Molitor: She’s the director of, um, security and takes her job very seriously.

Jonathan DeYoe: That’s right. I forgot you actually had titles for them, that part.

Speaker B: Oh, yeah.

Michele Molitor: Alice is vice president of.

Jonathan DeYoe: Oh, so cool.

Michele Molitor: Good to have jobs.

Jonathan DeYoe: So when you were growing, know you’ve been an entrepreneur for a long time, you’ve supported entrepreneurs for a long time. When you were growing up, what did you learn about entrepreneurship? Were your parents entrepreneurs? Did they run businesses? Did you watch them with this? How did you begin this process of learning?

Michele Molitor: Yes, my parents are serial entrepreneurs. They are coming up on their 64th wedding anniversary in February, and they’ve been business partners for most of that. And I grew up watching them run the family businesses. So my dad was one of the first to start an answering service back in the day. Like, plug in the wires here. Right? I remember going down to the answering service when I was five, six years old, and watching the ladies, everybody’s cigarettes hanging out of their mouth, talking on the phone, plugging and playing, all of that. And then they also had two Kelly service temporary agencies. So they did a lot of work to support the space coast industry in the very early days of, um, all the rockets taking off and all of that. Goodness. So I grew up watching rockets go off in my backyard. So that was really fun. And over the years, I’ve had many other businesses just for entertainment. My mom likes to design and build homes on the side, so they’ve always got their hands in something, even at 84. Actually, my dad’s 85th birthday was just the other day.

Jonathan DeYoe: Oh, wow. Did they involve you in whether it was some of the more scut work or did they sit down with you and say, hey, this is what marketing is when you were little, or can you tell us some of those experiences?

Michele Molitor: No, I didn’t get that formal marketing training, although that would have been good. No, I was pulled into the family business on summers or weekends to help out in different way shapes and forms. They had a paging company. I remember going around, driving all over Brevard county, changing out beepers and pagers and batteries and all those kinds of fun things. And then my brother and sister both worked in the family business. So my brother worked with my dad because the answering service morphed into a, uh, marketing fulfillment company and my sister helped manage the Kelly temp agencies and doing that through helping out through high school and whatnot. When I graduated from college, the day that I graduated from college, my parents were like, so, do you have a job? And I think they were fully expecting me to say, yes, I’m going to come home and I’m going to come join the family business. And I was like, yes, I do. I’m moving back to France and I’m going to be an pair and I leave in 30 days. Thank you. They were like, what? So the thought of joining the family business and being under the judgmental eye of my mom, my dad, my brother, my sister, I was like, oh no, that is so not happening. So I actually ran as far away as I could possibly conceive of, which was back to France for me. So becoming an entrepreneur myself wasn’t something I expected to do. It’s something I kind of stumbled into doing because it seemed like a better option at the time, given what had happened in my former career. So it’s been a, ah, learning journey the whole way for sure.

Jonathan DeYoe: What is it specifically about this, compared to being an employee, running your own show versus being an employee, what was it that was attractive early on that you thought was different?

Michele Molitor: Well, having been in the corporate world for ten years, I was a graphic designer and creative director in web development, and there was a lot of pros and cons to that on being. I got bullied out of my job and it was really painful. And in trying to figure out what I wanted to do next, I discovered coaching to help me figure out what that was and found my true calling and purpose. And so to me, that was the no brainer choice of do I try to figure out how to hand my resume to another company and risk the pain and the suffering of what I had just gone through? Or do I take on the risk of what if I start my own company and do something that I’m really called passionately to do? So the joys of having your own company are numerous, right? You get to set your own schedule, and you get to choose who you want to work with and who you don’t want to work with, versus the perceived security of working for another organization that’s doing all the other legwork.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: As a solopreneur, you have to wear the marketing hat and the sales hat and the operations hat, all of those things. So it’s a great way to stretch and grow, but it also has its ups and downs and uneasiness that goes with it too. It’s not for everyone, but it’s definitely a thrill ride for sure.

Jonathan DeYoe: So it’s been 20 something years.

Michele Molitor: You said 22 years since you. I started my business in 2001, and I’ve been in the work a day world for 30 something years now.

Jonathan DeYoe: So how is the client work? Working with entrepreneurs, running their own show? How has that changed over those years?

Michele Molitor: Gosh, that’s a great question. I think there are more and more people stepping into entrepreneurship now than ever before, especially since COVID Everyone thought, oh, I don’t actually have to spend 3 hours commuting every day and going to a job that I don’t necessarily like a whole lot just to pay the bills. And so it’s opened up whole new doors and possibilities for people to try something. And with the continued sophistication of technology that allows us to have podcasts over Zoom now.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: Allows us to communicate with people worldwide really effectively and efficiently. It’s opened so many more doors than ever before. So the work world has changed significantly, and corporations are now having to pivot. How do we make ourselves look most attractive to hiring the right people? I was just on, uh, a networking meeting the other day with a recruiter who was talking about the real challenges these days. She said for every 100 positions, there’s 58 applicants. So there’s a massive shortage of talent that corporations are going through because so many people have decided to go. Well, let me just go see if I can do this on my own in this way, shape, or form.

Jonathan DeYoe: I wonder. It’s been a long time. Have you ever seen this kind of an eB? Um, before the statistics bear out what you just said, the business starts in the last two years. We were all wondering, just up leading up to Covid, we were wondering what happened to the business starts? And then Covid hit, and then suddenly so many people started starting businesses. Have you seen that happen before? And I’m wondering if there’s been like a return after the fact, like, oh, I tried. It was really hard. I really need to just get a steady Paycheck again.

Speaker B: Yeah.

Michele Molitor: I think there was an uptick in 2008 with the housing crash and the market crash. Then again, people get disillusioned and, um, job security isn’t so secure anymore. People don’t stay in jobs for 1020, 30 years anymore. It’s just unheard of. And there’s not that level of loyalty, I think, in corporations nearly as much either.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: My next door neighbor, she retired from her job of like 24 years at the same company.

Jonathan DeYoe: I’ve never heard of that.

Michele Molitor: Uh, right. It’s just unheard of. And she’s only like three years older than I am. But my whole body, when I think of staying in the same company, doing the same thing, just makes it go.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: Because I’m a creative, I have to create new and different things.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: So it depends on the type of personality you have too.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: Some people like steady, consistent things that don’t change. That’s their comfort zone. To me, that’s like being locked in a box.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: Creativity is one of my biggest values. So if I’m not creating something new, whether that’s a talk or graphics or social posts or a new program to offer, then it’s not a good day. Right. So I’m always creating because that’s just part of who I am. And I think this new marketplace, if you want to call it, has given permission for those creative folks to really step out and find a different way to express that creativity that doesn’t have to be tied to a nine to five job anymore.

Jonathan DeYoe: Yeah. And with all the technology supporting us, people can. I mean, it’s actually really easy to do a side gig to test it out beforehand. Right. So it’s really neat.

Michele Molitor: Absolutely. Right. I’ll just do this and then see how this goes. And then I can just walk away from that job.

Jonathan DeYoe: Right. Build this while that one, and let this one decline. Build this one over here. It’s good stuff.

Michele Molitor: Yeah.

Jonathan DeYoe: So our listeners, so many people out there are really trying to find the way to well being, to thrive, to flourish. Right. And some people are very successful, and some people run into challenge. There’s something that dominates your website, like multiple pages. Talk about this thing. You talk about the five archetypes of self doubt. But rather than just touch on all of them, I want to see if we can start with impostor syndrome. And I want to start there because I literally was home for a week, and I talked about this at length with my parents. Just a quick, brief story. Like, I was raised with very little money, and so when I went into the financial services world, my boss set my minimum at two and a half million dollars. I had no idea how to talk to somebody that had two and a half million dollars, because I’d never even met anyone that had two and a half million dollars. Jonathan, you go talk to these people about investing, because you’re the expert. I’m like, not really. Right? So talk about imposter syndrome. I think it’s. I identify it in myself.

Michele Molitor: It is a very popular thing. Seven out of ten adults deal with imposter syndrome at some point in their life. And what it is, essentially, is that feeling of, um, I’m a fraud. Someone’s going to find out that I don’t know as much as they think that I know, and then they’re going to call me out and they’re going to judge me, or they’re going to fire me, or they’re going to reject me, whatever it might be, despite accolades, despite years of experience, despite all of the other things that you’ve done. And it’s a loop that plays in your head, who am I to do this? What will people think? Am I enough? Do I know enough? Have I earned my place at the table? And it can be a little, tiny imposter, or it can be a really loud, large impostor, right? Getting bullied out of my job created a massive case of impostor syndrome for me, and I was scared to death. To me. That’s why starting my own company was far less daunting than handing my resume to anybody at any company at that point in time, because I was like, I don’t know, am I doing this right? My brain was sideways because of the corporate PTSD that I had suffered. And so that’s why I’m so passionate about it and helping people move beyond it, because it can be very debilitating. It left me with anxiety attacks and just nervousness and depression. A whole host of fun things, right? And it can rear its little head in different places, right? So learning how to a recognize it and the self doubt underbelly of it, the fears, the worries, and all of the deeper layers of those triggers that create imposter syndrome up here. What I’ve found through all my research, Jonathan, is imposter syndrome. Is this politically correct, polite term that we can refer to in business company.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: Oh, I have impostor syndrome. Right. And it’s almost like I have a little badge of honor, right? I have imposter syndrome. But what it really is is I don’t believe in myself wholly and completely. And that level of vulnerability is a little more daunting for people to own up to and polite conversation. So that’s why, as I was looking at all of this, I identified those five self doubt archetypes so that we could pull it apart more and put those into the light so it becomes easier to talk about. Uh, one of my favorite quotes is when you look fear in the face, it turns into the nothingness that it actually is. So the more that we can talk about it, the more that we can make mental health just a regular conversation that we have, and that people have hard days. They have days where they don’t believe in themselves. They have days when they really believe, um, themselves.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: And in every place in between, then there’s nothing to be ashamed about. It’s just like, okay, these are the feelings that I’m feeling today, and I now have some tools to help me move forward in a better way with a better mindset and frame to work from.

Jonathan DeYoe: I know you’ve heard the phrase fake it till you make it. And I think that when I was in sales training, when I was 19, 2021, something like that, I heard that a lot. And just reflecting what you’re saying, I don’t know that what I had was impostor syndrome. I was an imposter. Right? I was in a space that I really didn’t belong, but I was learning and becoming. So what are the markers of. I actually might be having impostor syndrome or one of these other archetypes of self doubt, uh, rather than just, you know what? I really don’t belong here. How do I tell the difference?

Michele Molitor: Sure. Well, it’s a level of knowledge and expertise that you bring to the table when you’re 19. You’re still green. You’re still learning. So, yeah, I’m learning and putting my big girl painties on and trying to look like I’m professional, but I’m still not quite sure who I am yet.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: I think imposter syndrome shows up, qualifies more as, um, imposter syndrome. When you’ve grown a bit more, you’re a little bit more mature, you know who you are to degrees, and you have some level of established profession.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: You know what you know about what you know. And yet there are those things, those moments, those people, the phrases that someone could say to you that will hit one of those hot buttons that we have, that we don’t even know that we have, that make us wince a little bit and shrink back like, oh, maybe I don’t know everything that I think that I know. Maybe I don’t have all the right answers. Maybe I’m not enough.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: And we start that self comparison. It’s so easy to compare with everything that is social media these days, right? And that’s a whole nother topic for another day about mental well being. Right. But just recognizing the evidence of what do you really know?

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: What has your profession reflected back to you versus what you’re telling yourself and noticing the disconnect between those two places, if that makes sense.

Jonathan DeYoe: Yeah. What causes it? What makes me have impostor syndrome?

Michele Molitor: Well, typically, it’s because of, um, decision points that you made all the way back in your childhood.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: When we’re kids, we’re going along, we’re experiencing life. And people say things, people do things based on the environment that you grew up in. It might have been a sibling that made fun of you or shamed you, right? Or maybe it was, uh, a bully on the playground, or maybe it was a teacher who made fun of you because you didn’t get the answer right. Or worse. Right. There’s a huge gamut. But let’s say you had a teacher that picked on you to answer the question and you didn’t know the answer, you got it wrong. And they made some comments, right? Or when they made fun of you in that moment as a child, we make a decision, oh, I’m not smart enough. I don’t know the answer. And that belief drops into your subconscious, and it just stays there. And then you collect all these other beliefs, evidence to prove yourself right about that belief. And that is all sitting in your subconscious. And then it becomes the path that you move through life believing, oh, I’m not really smart enough. I don’t really know. I don’t want to raise my hand because I’ll get ridiculed, right? So I better not stand out. And it starts to compound and compound and compound. And most of the time, we don’t even know that we’re carrying these beliefs around until we’re in a place of adulthood and we’re learning what we’re learning, and we’re stretching and we’re growing. And someone says something in a way that’s just a little too similar, that strikes that chord, uh, that presses that little button in your subconscious the same way that your teacher did when you were in third grade, right? And it has, you go, oh, and you shrink back. And if you’re not self aware enough, you will react with a knee jerk reaction based on that place of fear from all those years ago disguised as this present moment.

Jonathan DeYoe: You used to talk about getting stuck and just listening to you talk, the whole idea, okay, you have this experience when you’re eight and you’re in the classroom and a teacher makes fun of a dumb answer you give, right, something like that. And then your brain sets up to use its confirmation bias. Your brain now starts to look for those things that will confirm what your teacher just said about you. And you do that for 25 years. You really do get stuck in that kind of stuff.

Michele Molitor: Absolutely.

Jonathan DeYoe: That’s very interesting. I hadn’t thought about it that way. Sort of the brain science. Do you see this in particular kinds of people or particular groups of people? Does it happen, uh, to somebody that grew up with less resources or more resources or with one parent or with lots of siblings or no siblings? Does it present more in some people than in others?

Michele Molitor: I love that question because it doesn’t matter the way. Well, it does matter. The environment that you grew up in always plays a huge part in who you see yourself to be. And whether you’re an only child or you grew up poor, or you grew up affluent and across the spectrums, right. Regardless of your race, your ethnicity, your age, where on the planet you grew up. I found in my work that we still make decision points about ourselves. Someone’s life experience could have been horrific, and someone’s life could have been very charmed, and yet they still have the same nervous anxiety, but they’re based in different things because of what was said to them, what was done to them. The experiences that they had, and everybody’s life experience is absolutely unique. So trying to put people in those kinds of boxes I found isn’t really useful. I just meet people where they are and listen and see what’s in there.

Jonathan DeYoe: How novel to meet people where they, uh, you met m, you just touched on this in passing and m, I’m not going to let it go. Do you think in our hyperconnected social media world, where if I just logged into Facebook right now, I would see all kinds of intentional impostors? Now, what is that set up for me in my own feeling of enoughness? When I’m looking at all these people that are driving great cars and taking great vacations and sitting at great meals with lots of friends, and everyone’s laughing and having a good time. And I don’t feel that internally. What does that set up for me?

Michele Molitor: Can create a whole cascade, um, of self comparison, of, um, self loathing, of not enoughness. I’m not lovable. I’m not successful. It can create shame. It just creates all these different emotions if you’re not checking yourself, right? I can get caught in, and I can look at it and go, right? And I’m like, wait a minute.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: So it’s purposefully designed to create stickiness, right? We all want beautiful things in our lives. We all want sparkly lives with happy, shiny faces, but we all know that’s not the reality of life. There’s moments of it, right? And social media has made all of those moments glorified. And for most people, that might be only snippets of their reality, if at all. And that can take people down the rabbit hole very quickly. And that’s why it’s not surprising to me that we have the mental health issues that we have now because of all of that self comparison. It fosters impostor syndrome. That fosters a whole host of other us versus them dynamics and based on half truths or no truths. And I find it a little. A lot disheartening, actually. And so I try to create a social media diet along with a news diet, right, because it’s not food for your soul, right? Watching all the negativity that we see on the news, just feed your body with that negative energy. Or looking at all the stuff on social media that triggers the self comparison, again, is creating a negative reaction in your body, which is very detrimental to your whole mind body spirit connection and your well being.

Jonathan DeYoe: I know you work with executives and entrepreneurs, right? So I imagine that the awareness of this and the awareness of imposter syndrome and the awareness of the fragility we have when we’re looking into social media, it affects business, it affects my ability to start a thing, right? But it also affects everything else in my life. So when you’re working with somebody, do you differentiate? Or is it like, let’s solve this issue that is at the center of you. Do we work on this for business, or do we solve the human problem?

Michele Molitor: We solve the human problem because no matter how hard someone tries to separate their work from their business, from their personal life, they’re the human at the center of all of it, right? And it’s the beliefs that they hold about themselves that have them show up fully or hide out, whether that’s personally or professionally, whether that’s selling their widgets or talking to their partner, whether they’re taking care of themselves, physically, emotionally, or they’re hiding out, and they just fall into a lump. All of those behaviors, good, bad, or ugly, starts with how we perceive ourselves, which then creates its own cascade of chemical reactions in your body. Good, bad, and indifferent.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: We can geek out on the neuroscience of this, too, if you want. It’s super fun.

Jonathan DeYoe: Let’s save that for another one to get really depth in the neuroscience. But we’ve been talking about imposter syndrome, specifically, how does that fit into the five archetypes? Does it split into the five archetypes, or is it one of the five archetypes? How does it fit in?

Michele Molitor: So, the way I look at it, Jonathan is here at, uh, the top layer is imposter syndrome, right? It’s this nice label that we’ve given, this sensation that we feel in our body. And when I really dug into it, I broke it down into these five different self doubt archetypes, because there’s different types of self doubt that trigger different aspects of this feeling of imposter syndrome, right. And so that’s why I felt it was important to do that, so that folks could understand it more easily and more effectively and see within themselves how it was impacting them, but more importantly, how to let go of it, right. Because nobody wants to hold on to it and have it keep them stuck.

Jonathan DeYoe: So each of the five has its own identifying markers and potential resolutions. Am I reading that right?

Michele Molitor: Yes.

Jonathan DeYoe: Can you take us through one of them from end to end? Like, what’s the identifying marker? How would you name it? What’s the identifying marker? And then how would you resolve it?

Michele Molitor: Sure. So, as I said, there’s five different self doubt archetypes that I’ve identified, and each one has its own set of beliefs and its own set of trigger points. So let’s look at, for example, the procrastinating Perfectionist. Okay? The procrastinating perfectionist is someone who will prepare endlessly to get something, right. And they think everything has to be perfect before they can engage, before they can really put something forth. Because there’s an inherent fear of failure, right? There’s a fear of losing control, a fear of being criticized from others that leads to this, I’m not enough conversation.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: And in doing so, they’re holding themselves back from everything that they could potentially be doing, and yet they’re too afraid to allow themselves to not be perfect because of the programming that they received at some point in their lives. So it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy as well. And so the more you can pull these apart, the more you can see what’s at the root causes of them, the more quickly you can look that fear in the face and go, oh, no, I’m going to take my power back from that because that’s not actually true of who I am.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: So, for example, the procrastinating perfectionist might say no to getting help because they think, well, it’ll just take longer for me to explain it to you, Jonathan. I’ll just do it myself. But really, it’s about having control, right? And then underneath that, it’s a fear of, well, if I give you control and then you don’t get it, right, then how is that going to make me look? Because I want to be right. I want to be in control, and I want to look good because I have to be perfect. Does that make sense?

Jonathan DeYoe: It makes sense. I know that you have some diagnostics that you have created for this. Can you just reference that real quick and we’ll make sure we put that into the show notes?

Michele Molitor: Yeah. So I have a, uh, self doubt quiz that I created called taming yourself doubt. That’s the free master class that I have for it. The quiz is your self doubt finder. There we go. That’s what I was looking for. And it’s a quick little three minute quiz that you can take. It’ll help you identify your top self doubt archetype. Of the five, we all typically have different layers of them, right? One will be more pronounced than another. And just like the love languages, we typically have one or two that we operate from most fully. It’s the same thing with the self doubt archetypes, but it’s a quick way to just start to see where is my self doubt holding me back? And how is it showing up in my career? How is it showing up in my relationships? How is it showing up in my money? How is it showing up in how I deal with conflict, right? All these different areas that it seeps into and starts to create these barriers to keep ourselves safe, because ultimately, it’s your amygdala, that part of your brain that is your fight, slide or freeze mechanism that’s trying to protect you.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: Don’t do that. It’s not safe. Oh, okay. Right. So next thing you know, after however many years it’s been, you’re covered in all these protective layers, all these shields, but then you can’t get through. You can’t let your light shine fully, you can’t be seen fully for the brilliance and the genius and the talent that you truly possess.

Jonathan DeYoe: There’s something I want to peel off in there. And you say you’re a perfectionist. You say impostor syndrome. So every time I hear someone talk about one of these things, not 100% of the time, but many times, I can self identify, I can say, yeah, I got a little bit of that in me. Yeah, I got a little bit of that in me. Do you think it’s something that we all have bits and pieces of all of this stuff, and then I have this experience, and this thing rises for me so that I can always go back and say, yes, I have that. And, uh, different experience. A different thing arises for me. So it sounds like it’s not something that we ever get rid of. It’s something that we learn how to live with. Is that a good way to say.

Michele Molitor: It’S a fair assessment? There are different levels of it.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: Not everyone grows up in an abusive household or with a narcissistic parent or have gone through x types of trauma that create particular flavors of self doubt.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: The shapeshifter is one who will continually morph themselves to stay safe, because that’s what was required in the, uh, abusive environment that they grew up in. And that’s the extreme example. But, yes, the fact that we all deal with self doubt at some point in our lives, no one escapes it. The trick is learning to recognize it in the moment more quickly because you’re more self aware, and then learning how to respond effectively versus react from a place of pain or fear. That’s the crux right there is how do I respond versus react? And that’s where the learning happens for our listeners.

Jonathan DeYoe: Mindfulness will help here. I’m just going to put that in there.

Michele Molitor: Drop that little nugget.

Jonathan DeYoe: Just drop it. So, I’m sure everyone’s experienced this at some point. What do you do about it? Million dollar question. So I recognize it myself. I have this thing. What do I do about it?

Michele Molitor: That is the million dollar question. But I don’t charge a million dollars. That’s a good thing. It’s learning to identify the root cause of those beliefs and then rewiring them.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: Science tells us that our brains are plastic. We can always learn new things. Neuroplasticity tells us that our brain will rewire itself as we learn new things. And even, like, if someone’s had a stroke, different parts of the brain will come in and take over for the parts that have died so that you regain the capabilities, those parts of yourself. And so my work basically helps folks rewire their brains. Noticing, getting at, uh, the root cause, the root belief, where the kernel was planted in the first place, the event that has created some level of emotional residue in their system.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: When we’re children, our brains aren’t fully formed yet, and so we don’t have the cognitive capacity to deal with various levels of traumatic effects or events in our lives. We cope, and we create these coping mechanisms thanks to our amygdala. But as we get older, those programs that were put in your place dropped into our subconscious early on. They get outdated. Just like updating your phone, you got to update your programming in your brain, right? How often do you update your programming in your brain? Not nearly as often as we update our phones.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: So when you recognize that there is a belief that is no longer serving you or is, uh, getting in your way or is creating a level of discomfort that you really don’t want to hold on to any longer, that’s when people call me. Because together, using hypnotherapy and coaching, what I call rapid rewiring, we use hypnotherapy as a way to drop someone into a very relaxed alpha brainwave state where I’m able to talk with your subconscious, like, where did this come from? When was the first time you experienced this? And your brain will bubble up to the surface all the information we need to know. And in that moment, we’re not reliving the experience. We’re simply noticing the belief that was created and then choosing a new belief. Like, okay, I decided that I wasn’t good enough when I was six. So now how about I choose that I am enough? Okay, how does that feel differently? Well, it feels differently in my whole body. So I’m going to choose the thing that feels good versus the thing that doesn’t feel good. When you can identify the root cause, then you can start to repave that neural pathway, if you will, with new beliefs. I am enough. Of course I’m enough. I’ve always been enough. I was born enough. I will die being enough. And part of the way to do that is through repetition. So I create these customized recordings mixed with binaural beat music at a particular tone and cadence for my clients. And they listen to it as they drift off to sleep at night. And the repetition of listening to it over 30 days is what literally builds the new neural pathways in your brain, right? So you go from this anxious, fearful person to, oh, I am enough. And it creates a level of calm and peace within you and that old way of being is like, what was I so worried about? Right. It shifts for people and it disappears itself, I found, often rather quickly. It’s really fun to watch.

Jonathan DeYoe: Yeah. I think, uh, you say you can sort of complete this process in 90 days, is that right?

Michele Molitor: Yeah. I found that to be the sweet spot for most clients. There’s some that take a little more, some take a little less.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: But over 90 days, we are basically having weekly sessions, whether that’s coaching or hypnotherapy, to get at the root causes and then put in new layers of beliefs and habits and action strategies to move themselves forward. So, for example, I had someone reach out to me and said, I want to grow my business. And every time I get to this particular level of success, I hit a ceiling. And then I do something unconsciously and I sabotage myself. And then my money drops. And then I have this terrible case of IBS. Oh, I’m like, wow. Well, do you want to fix that? Yes, I do. Thank you. Please.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: And so, in the work that we did, she was able to get at the root belief of, if I have too much, then essentially bad things will happen, so I better not have too much. So every time she would get to that ceiling and try to surpass it, her subconscious mind would go, oh, no, um, bad things will happen. Let’s not do that.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: And then there’s a, uh, level of unconscious sabotage that happens. And in resolving that belief and shifting it, her ibs went away because it was creating this level of anxiety, emotional anxiety, unprocessed emotion in your gut, which is the root of your emotional body. So when you shift the emotions, oftentimes you can heal a lot of gut issues or significantly reduce them, for sure.

Jonathan DeYoe: I’m just curious, do you ever work with somebody that says, I don’t believe in all this emotion, hypnotherapy? That’s all levitation to me. Do you ever get any of that pushback?

Michele Molitor: I don’t work with folks like that because they’re not drawn to work with me.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: If someone doesn’t believe that what I do can be of assistance, then they’re probably not going to pick up the phone and call me.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: The folks that I work with are those who have already done some level of personal development. They understand that there is some level of mind body connection, and they’re curious to learn more. And there’s this thing in their legs that they really want to move out of the way. Like, I tried everything else. I don’t know what else to do. I don’t know how to illuminate this. And that’s when they show up at my doorstep, my zoom doorstep, if you will. Uh, because I work with people all over the world over Zoom, but those are the folks who make great clients because they’re really interested in moving the block out of the way. They’re done with it, and they just haven’t figured out how to unlock it out of their system and let it know.

Jonathan DeYoe: I was raised in South Dakota, and so I have this gut reaction to hypnotherapy, but I want to back it up with something else. So when I was young, and I don’t know why, I share these kinds of stories in a podcast, but I was a bedwetter. I wet my bed until I was, like, nine or ten years old, way longer than I was supposed to. My aunt, this is my crazy aunt, my mom’s sister, she’s the crazy one. Everyone knows she’s the crazy one. Everyone loves her, but she’s a little bit out there. She said, you know what? Let me make you a tape. And she made me a hypnotherapy tape. And I listened to that. We did some sessions, just she and I, and then she made me this tape, and I listened to this tape, and I tried everything, right? She made me this tape, and I listened to this tape for, like, 30 days, and I stopped wedding the bed. That is literally how it worked for me. So I do believe in it. But I also have this thing that I was raised with, this, uh, that’s a little bit fru fru. That’s a little bit weird, but it works. So proof is in the pudding. It does work.

Michele Molitor: The proof is in the know it. I appreciate you sharing that story, Jonathan, because when I first came to coaching, I thought it was a little woo woo. I’m m like, no one’s going to buy coaching. It’s too woo woo. Like, how do I get into the corporate market? Oh, they won’t buy that. It’s too woo woo. Coaches make bajillions of dollars working in corporate.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: It’s a very sound, proven technique of helping people shift their perspectives and find new ways forward. And when I first experienced hypnotherapy, probably 20 years ago, it felt good. It was very relaxing. But it didn’t really create any shifts for me because it wasn’t that piece of the puzzle, the recording, which is really key, that I found. And it wasn’t until six years ago when I discovered the hypno therapy that I now practice called RTT, or rapid transformational therapy, that I saw how powerful it was because it shifted things in me within weeks. Like, boom, um, done. I was like, oh, okay, there’s something to that. And that’s what had me dive deep into the pool. But over these last 20 years of doing this work, that’s why I’ve gotten so into the neuroscience of it, because I had to prove to myself, well, it’s actually not woo woo. It’s just science. It’s energy and it’s science, and it’s your brain doing what your brain does and the chemicals in your body and all of that. So that’s why I like to geek out on it, because it’s just science. And if you want to call it woo, you can, but it’s just who we are.

Jonathan DeYoe: Woo woo works. I want to put this kind of in context, because today we’re sort of going through a unique bunch of changes in the universe, hybrid work environment. People, as you mentioned, are seeking a better work life balance. Uh, people are launching new businesses. They got their own ideas. There is this technological backdrop that will support you doing everything you want when you’re doing the work. How are people presenting differently now than they did just three years ago? Is there more of any of these subsets of imposter syndrome? Is there less? How are people presenting?

Michele Molitor: That’s an interesting question. I think the levels of, um, worry, fear, anxiety, of course, have kind of gone off the charts. Yeah, I feel that.

Jonathan DeYoe: Personally, I feel that, right?

Michele Molitor: There’s a collective level of COVID PTSD, pandemic PTSD, that we are all dealing with. As a person who has a very high level of sensitivity to other people’s emotions, I have very active mirror neurons in my brain. I just pick up on how other people feel, and it’s because we’re all energy, right? And when you’ve got stuff happening in the news every day and people are watching the news, it creates this vibration, right, that so many of us, we all pick up on it, whether we’re cognizant to it or not. That’s the differentiator, right? But we’re all picking up on it at a cellular level. And so that has an impact on how people see themselves, how they function, how they succeed and thrive or don’t at work. I’ve had clients who are veterans in their industry and are dealing with anxiety and panic attacks because they’re waking up in the middle of the night. Am I getting it right? Am I doing enough? Even though they know their business and they know how to do it, and they’ve been doing it for years.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: There’s this massive case of imposter syndrome. And I think what I’ve seen is that it’s because of this overlay of this global anxiety that we’re all like, swimming in the soup of that. Then when your brain doesn’t know how to label it, it picks a low hanging fruit. Let’s call it work is the problem, right? Or my relationship is the problem, or my health is the problem. And they apply that feeling of anxiety to that thing, because that’s a known thing versus this ambiguous sensation that they’re just feeling, and there’s nothing tangible that they can grab onto to then help alleviate it. So that’s what I’m seeing, and it impacts people personally and professionally in a whole host of ways, physically and emotionally as well.

Jonathan DeYoe: So we’ve sort of defined this issue very broadly. One of the things, and I know that people can call you and you can help them, uh, but I want to help people before they call you. So one of the things we want to do is we want to actually, in every one of these podcasts, every interview that I do, I want to do two very specific things. I want to give somebody, I want to give everyone that listens a tool that they can walk away from this podcast with, and they can say, I’m going to do this thing and it’s going to change my life. I’m going to do this one thing. It’s very simple. Anyone can do it. So, uh, I want to know what that one thing is from your perspective. And the second thing is, there’s so much crap out there that people tell us to do, and there’s so many things to be worried about, and there’s so many things that people talk about, and most of it’s bunk. Like, most of it doesn’t really help. So what are some of those things that work, or one of the things that we are hearing about that people are telling us to pay attention to that we really shouldn’t? So what’s one thing we should do that will change our lives, one thing that maybe we can ignore?

Michele Molitor: Oh, uh, the second question is a little trickier. But the first question, what’s one thing that people can do? And I do this. This is a simple thing that I do on talks that I give all of the time.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: First notice, what is one thought that is not serving you very well? What’s the looping thought, the negative looping thought that is creating angst in your body that is creating a negative feeling in your body.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: So you get to be the guinea pig today, Jonathan. So what’s one looping thought that really isn’t serving you very well?

Jonathan DeYoe: The thing that popped into my head was, I’m hungry. Uh, that’s what popped into my head, but that probably doesn’t qualify, so let me give it a second. There is a thought. There’s something that actually is very consistent. Why’d you do this to me?

Michele Molitor: You started it.

Jonathan DeYoe: I know. So I feel like I am derailed because of. I’ve lost my morning routines. I feel like I need my morning routine to be nailed before my life can be solid. And my morning routine has been an absolute mess since my brother died. And I’ve been trying to put it back together. I’ve been trying to meditate every day. I’ve been trying to work out, but I’m adding weight. Um, my mental acuity is not what it was. It’s been 14 months, and I’m having a hard time getting it back. And so I’m, um, pointing to that one thing, and that one thing is my solution, and I just seem to not be able to get back to that. So the thought is, I can’t do it. And I keep getting back to I can’t do it.

Michele Molitor: Okay, thank you. So when you think, I can’t do it, how does it feel in your body?

Jonathan DeYoe: It’s actually right here is tight right in the back, lower middle of the back, upper back is just really tight.

Michele Molitor: Okay. So when you take that one thought and you flip it to its exact positive opposite, I can do it. So say that out loud. I can do it.

Jonathan DeYoe: I can do it. Do you have to believe it yet or just say it?

Michele Molitor: Just say it. So I want you to say it. I can do it. And I want you to notice, how does your body feel when you actually say, I can do it, I can do it. I can do it.

Jonathan DeYoe: I can do it. I can do it. I can do it.

Michele Molitor: What are you noticing in the energy in your body now?

Jonathan DeYoe: Honestly, I don’t tell the difference. It does move down a little bit. It moves down. The tightness moves down my back a little bit. Doesn’t go away, but it moves down my back.

Michele Molitor: Okay, got it. So the shift is to take the negative belief, flip it to the exact opposite.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: I can’t do it to. I can do it. And noticing the sensations in your body. So I can’t do it. Creates that tension all the way down your back.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: And if we sat here long enough and you kept repeating to yourself, I can do it, I can do it. I can do it. And just watch, just notice the energy, because it’s just that emotion that’s just energy in your body, and you can just watch that energy shift and morph and release and dissipate.

Speaker B: Right.

Jonathan DeYoe: I think the one thing then is to notice what the thing is and then express the exact opposite. Is that right?

Michele Molitor: Okay.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: And tell yourself the thing that feels better. Because if I can’t makes you feel tight and crunchy, and I can do it takes you to a place of more, uh, relaxed, more openness. Which one feels better? Right. And so you’re always at choice. So then you get to consciously choose the thought that feels better and keep choosing it. And keep choosing it and keep choosing it so that you can get to the place of, uh, my body feels better. And then when you feel better, then you can take new, different empowering steps that move you forward in that positive direction versus continuing to pull you back down the rabbit hole.

Jonathan DeYoe: All right, so I have to repeat that many, many times so I can start climbing out. What’s one of those things that we hear about or that people tell us about or it’s in the media that we should just put down?

Michele Molitor: Gosh, I don’t know. Actually, you might have stumped me on that one. There’s a lot of negativity in the media, and I think just turning off the media, right. Taking a break, turning off the news, stepping back from things that don’t make you feel good.

Speaker B: Right.

Michele Molitor: I mean, we’re here on the planet to share our gifts, to be of contribution and to feel good about the contributions that we’re making. And if you’re always consuming things, whether that’s media or food or activities that make you feel bad about yourself, then you probably need to change that habit for something that feels better, that lifts your spirit, that expands your mind in a good way so that you can get back to doing what you’re here to do and the purpose that you’re here to give.

Jonathan DeYoe: So I heard a subtext in there, and the subtext was, we believe that we really have to pay attention to the media so that we are informed citizens. But maybe we don’t need to pay as close attention as we believe we do. We’re told that we’re supposed to. And maybe that’s the thing, is you don’t really need. I have this. This is an argument I have with Kate all the time. She thinks it’s really important. I’m, like, less than. But you got to know some.

Michele Molitor: Yeah. No, and I would agree with that. Thank you for pulling that right. Because I think if we can take more time to pause on our day, to get quiet, to tune in to our own heart, our own spirit, right in that place of mindfulness, to go to that void, that we can get more connected to our own higher self, our own divinity, if you will, and let that inform us as to what’s needed. Now, I have a friend and colleague of mine who I studied with many years ago. He’s a coach now. He trained as a monk for a few years. He went off trekking, he landed in a monastery, stayed trained as a monk, finally left, came back to the world, and now is a coach and a hypnotherapist. Thank you very much. And he used to always say, if you’re caught, it’s like, just pause and ask yourself what’s needed now and just stop and listen and let your inner guidance point you, because your intuition always knows. It’s just a matter of tuning in enough to hear it and following it.

Jonathan DeYoe: We started off very personally with the, uh, animals and where you’re from and everything. I’d like to end kind of personally as well. So what was the last thing? And I think you’ll be able to get this one. What was the last thing you changed your mind about?

Michele Molitor: Oh, that’s a great question. What’s the last thing I changed my mind about? How I have to do my business. It doesn’t have to be hard. It doesn’t have to look like all these other people, right? Their formula is not my formula for success. And so to stop pushing rocks uphill.

Jonathan DeYoe: You are your business. You are the magic ingredient. Uh, your business is you. Is there anything that people forget about you or that you don’t say that you want them to know about you, that maybe they just miss?

Michele Molitor: Yes. Actually, a, uh, former client pointed this out to me on a talk that I gave recently. She’s like, Michele you are a hypnotherapist, and you are a coach, and people don’t recognize the power of those two. Like I tell folks, I take this inside out approach because I work at a deeper subconscious level, but then we take that deeper subconscious level to inform what’s the conscious level, what’s the outward actions that you take in your business.

Speaker B: Right?

Michele Molitor: So when you change the insight on how you see yourself and how you perceive yourself, it has a ripple effect on how you show up in your business, how you manage and run your business, how you make those sales calls, those marketing calls. So I have a ton of business and marketing and leadership skills, tools that I bring to the table that I take for granted because I just have a bunch of them, right? And I forget to mention that it’s a combination of these two things. That is my secret sauce that makes me the mind detective, because I’m able to not only see into your heart of, uh, what makes you tick and how to have you shine more brightly, but then what are the tangible steps and strategies that you specifically need to put into place to move your business or your career forward in a way that is aligned with your heart and your values versus all the shoulds and the couldas and the wouldas that maybe you are trying to carry with you.

Jonathan DeYoe: So I’m just going to give you a little just suggestion. You should go listen to last week’s episode because I interviewed a woman who talks about hybrid professional how we are all operating in the space between multiple professional identities. And then how do we identify that? How do we name it? How do we talk about what her book is on? That’s what her research is on. I think it’s perfect.

Michele Molitor: I love that.

Jonathan DeYoe: The last episode, I think you really like it. How do people get in touch with you? How do we connect with you? Where are you on social media? Give us your website, those links.

Michele Molitor: Sure. You can always find me@michellemolotor.com. M. You can find me on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram at rapid rewiring or come over and join my Facebook group rewire for success. We have a lovely tribe, lovely community there of ah folks of like minded, successful professionals from around the globe. So meet some new folks, start some conversations. It’s all good. But I’m m always happy to have a complimentary conversation with anyone who’s curious about this work and interested in moving some old junk out of their chunk that they no longer need and rewire their minds and their hearts for better ways of being and greater well being and happiness.

Jonathan DeYoe: Michele thank you for coming on. We’ll make sure all that stuff is.

Michele Molitor: In the show notes thank you, Jonathan, it’s such a joy being here with you and really a pleasure as always.

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